{"id":9587,"date":"2023-04-28T19:03:29","date_gmt":"2023-04-28T19:03:29","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/www.deltastate.edu\/library\/?page_id=9587"},"modified":"2023-04-28T19:03:29","modified_gmt":"2023-04-28T19:03:29","slug":"hilda-povall-oral-history","status":"publish","type":"page","link":"https:\/\/www.deltastate.edu\/library\/hilda-povall-oral-history\/","title":{"rendered":"Hilda Povall Oral History"},"content":{"rendered":"[vc_row type=”in_container” full_screen_row_position=”middle” column_margin=”default” column_direction=”default” column_direction_tablet=”default” column_direction_phone=”default” scene_position=”center” text_color=”dark” text_align=”left” row_border_radius=”none” row_border_radius_applies=”bg” overlay_strength=”0.3″ gradient_direction=”left_to_right” shape_divider_position=”bottom” bg_image_animation=”none”][vc_column column_padding=”no-extra-padding” column_padding_tablet=”inherit” column_padding_phone=”inherit” column_padding_position=”all” column_element_spacing=”default” background_color_opacity=”1″ background_hover_color_opacity=”1″ column_shadow=”none” column_border_radius=”none” column_link_target=”_self” gradient_direction=”left_to_right” overlay_strength=”0.3″ width=”1\/1″ tablet_width_inherit=”default” tablet_text_alignment=”default” phone_text_alignment=”default” bg_image_animation=”none” border_type=”simple” column_border_width=”none” column_border_style=”solid”][divider line_type=”No Line”][vc_column_text]\n

Hilda Povall Oral History<\/span><\/h1>\n[\/vc_column_text][divider line_type=”No Line”][page_submenu alignment=”center” sticky=”true” bg_color=”#008542″ link_color=”#ffffff”][page_link link_url=”https:\/\/www.deltastate.edu\/library\/manuscripts-and-guides\/” title=”Manuscripts & Subject Guides<\/strong>” id=”1682708221144-1″ tab_id=”1682708221145-10″] [\/page_link][page_link link_url=”https:\/\/www.deltastate.edu\/library\/guides-to-the-collection-page\/” title=”Collections Portal<\/strong>” id=”1682708221152-1″ tab_id=”1682708221153-3″] [\/page_link][page_link title=”Visit<\/strong>” id=”1682708229321-9″ tab_id=”1682708229323-5″ link_url=”https:\/\/www.deltastate.edu\/library\/departments\/archives-museum\/visit\/”][\/page_link][page_link title=”Make a Request<\/strong>” id=”1682708230404-6″ tab_id=”1682708230405-1″ link_url=”https:\/\/www.deltastate.edu\/library\/departments\/archives-museum\/requests\/”][\/page_link][page_link title=”About Us<\/strong>” id=”1682708232131-1″ tab_id=”1682708232132-8″ link_url=” https:\/\/www.deltastate.edu\/library\/departments-archives-museum-about-us\/”][\/page_link][page_link title=”Yearbooks Online<\/strong>” id=”1682708232795-8″ tab_id=”1682708232795-7″ link_url=” https:\/\/www.deltastate.edu\/library\/departments\/archives-museum\/yearbooks-alumni-magazines-delta-state-histories\/”][\/page_link][\/page_submenu][\/vc_column][\/vc_row][vc_row type=”in_container” full_screen_row_position=”middle” column_margin=”default” column_direction=”default” column_direction_tablet=”default” column_direction_phone=”default” scene_position=”center” text_color=”dark” text_align=”left” row_border_radius=”none” row_border_radius_applies=”bg” overlay_strength=”0.3″ gradient_direction=”left_to_right” shape_divider_position=”bottom” bg_image_animation=”none”][vc_column column_padding=”no-extra-padding” column_padding_tablet=”inherit” column_padding_phone=”inherit” column_padding_position=”all” column_element_spacing=”default” background_color_opacity=”1″ background_hover_color_opacity=”1″ column_shadow=”none” column_border_radius=”none” column_link_target=”_self” gradient_direction=”left_to_right” overlay_strength=”0.3″ width=”1\/1″ tablet_width_inherit=”default” tablet_text_alignment=”default” phone_text_alignment=”default” bg_image_animation=”none” border_type=”simple” column_border_width=”none” column_border_style=”solid”][vc_column_text]Interview with Hilda Povall OH# 387 on September 24, 2007<\/strong><\/p>\n

Interviewed by Emily Weaver and Dr. Cameron McMillen<\/strong><\/p>\n

Transcribed by W. Ray <\/strong><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

Side A<\/em><\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 This is Emily Weaver and I\u2019m with Dr. Cameron McMillen and we are in the Povall home this evening and we are speaking with Mrs. Hilda Povall about her house and the Historic Neighborhood Project.\u00a0 Mrs. Povall do you willingly participate in this oral history project?<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yes I do.<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Well great, thank you. Cam.<\/p>\n

CM:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I understand that you are not from Cleveland?<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 That is correct.<\/p>\n

CM:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 How long have you lived in Cleveland?<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 We moved in Cleveland in August 1973.<\/p>\n

CM:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Did you move into this house?<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 No.\u00a0 Victoria.\u00a0 South Victoria, about two blocks over.<\/p>\n

CM:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Do you remember the number?<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I\u2019m trying to think.<\/p>\n

CM:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Or who lives there now?<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 702 I think.\u00a0 It was a small little rental house next door to the Whittington\u2019s.\u00a0 And they are no longer here.\u00a0 They\u2019ve moved to Jackson.\u00a0 It was a great little house. \u00a0Tiny, tiny.\u00a0 You could stand in the Breakfast Room and touch everything \u2013 every room in the house.<\/p>\n

CM:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 And did you move from there to here?<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 We moved from South Victoria to Lamar Street.\u00a0 1307 or something near Canal.\u00a0 We were just one house off Canal Avenue.<\/p>\n

CM:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 And then to here?<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 And then to here in 1981.<\/p>\n

CM:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Do you know the history of this house?<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Some.\u00a0 I know that it was built in 1912 more or less, and finished maybe in 1913.\u00a0 Somewhere in that neighborhood.\u00a0 We found \u2013 I knew that was the date that I had been told but when we were doing some renovations we found some old Commercial Appeal newspapers stuffed in the walls.\u00a0 It was pretty funny, just you know, little sections.\u00a0 And then the original owners were the Shands.\u00a0 Audley Shands, who was an attorney.<\/p>\n

CM:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 How do you spell that?<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 A-u-d-e-l-e-y I think.\u00a0 Audeley \u2013 I\u2019ll have to think.\u00a0 That doesn\u2019t sound right.<\/p>\n

CM:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 That\u2019s about right.<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 But he\u2019s in a lot of the Cleveland history.\u00a0\u00a0 The Bi-centennial Book.\u00a0 And he moved to Cleveland to represent the railroad.\u00a0 And they built this home and it was the first house on this block.\u00a0 And I think it was followed soon thereafter by Mr. Ward.\u00a0 But they owned all of the lot that this is on, and the lot next door and straight through in behind.\u00a0 All the way to Leflore, the whole block.\u00a0 And we had a picture somewhere which I wish I could find to show you tonight of two of the Shands children standing inside the yard by the porch shade and you can see nothing but cotton fields behind the house\u00a0 And that\u2019s pretty neat.\u00a0 The Shands have been back and Kirk was asking me today if I knew how to find them and I said I do not but I\u2019ve got on my list to call LePoint Smith and ask how to get in touch with them because you know they are not going to be with us much longer.<\/p>\n

CM:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Did you buy the house from them?<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 From Bootsy Ashley who now lives right up the street here on Bolivar.\u00a0 Mr. Ashley and her husband bought the house, I believe in the \u201850\u2019s, because Wally Ashley if you know Wally, he is the only son of the children of Mrs. Wally and I think there were two sisters and he is the only child that still lives in Cleveland.\u00a0 They grew up here.\u00a0 And as I understand they bought the house in the very early \u201850\u2019s from Mrs. Shands who her husband had died much earlier.\u00a0 And she lived here as a widow and during World War II, and even in the \u201830\u2019s rented out rooms in the back of the house.\u00a0 So when we moved in there were two apartments in the back of the house.\u00a0 That\u2019s kind of interesting.\u00a0 She must have lived in this front bedroom as best we could figure, Mrs. Shands.\u00a0 And there\u2019s a set of back steps that we think at one time was the back porch and there was a little one bedroom apartment on the north side and there was this tiny little kitchenette in the closet which was I guess one of the first, I don\u2019t know who made them, but you know Sears or whoever, but the little metal \u2013 they were very heavy and had the little stove, sink, refrigerator and a tiny little stove.\u00a0 And then on the south side of the back of the house which is where our bedroom is now, there was another apartment.\u00a0 And it had a much larger room with a bathroom and a much larger kitchen.\u00a0 It was not in a closet.\u00a0 It was actually a small little room which you couldn\u2019t do much in there. \u00a0And it was a window at the top of the stairs which makes us think that this front part of the house was the original structure.\u00a0 And then at some point, maybe in the \u201830\u2019s, they added on a whole back section upstairs and downstairs and over the porch.\u00a0 I think that room on the back was a back porch and that was pretty clear.\u00a0 And about four years ago when we did another renovation and we took all of the ceiling tiles \u2013 sheetrock and stuff down and went back to the bead boards you could see the opening where the porch stairs had been, you know to go upstairs, so that was kind of fun.\u00a0 But anyway, they had the two apartments and when Mrs. Shands sold it to Mrs. Ashley, they just left all of that in there and the kids grew up here and I think they all had a great time growing up.\u00a0 So we were the third family to live here.\u00a0 We bought it in \u201981.<\/p>\n

CM:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 So a hundred years and only three families.<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 That\u2019s pretty impressive.<\/p>\n

CM:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 You\u2019ve got some gorgeous woodwork here.\u00a0 Is it all original to the house?<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Absolutely.\u00a0 We haven\u2019t changed – nothing structurally to the front of the house.\u00a0 All of this was plaster originally.\u00a0 And at some point they, I guess the Ashley\u2019s did the sheetrock but if you\u2019ll look up at the top of the stairs you can see the hallway upstairs is the only thing left of this plaster.\u00a0 There.<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Oh yeah.<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 And then the hallway upstairs (inaudible) and this front bedroom is still plaster.\u00a0 Which I have no intentions of changing.<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 It\u2019s difficult to take plaster down or to change that.<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 It\u2019s hard as a rock.\u00a0 I mean it\u2019s like concrete.\u00a0 And the plaster \u2013 it\u2019s interesting, Mary Elizabeth\u2019s house down the street that they just bought which was the Hill home, had a different sort of plaster in it that was more sheetrocky.\u00a0 I don\u2019t know how to describe it, but it was not this stuff.\u00a0 This stuff is heavy duty.\u00a0 I mean it is like concrete.\u00a0 We\u2019ve tried to put this mirror in and you had to I mean\u2026<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Drill?<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 It was incredible.\u00a0 The carpenters \u2013 and the same thing on securing these mirrors.\u00a0 It was a major challenge.<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 They are not going anywhere.<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 No, they\u2019re not going anywhere.\u00a0 But getting the hooks through the concrete and it\u2019s real interesting to get through the sheetrock and then you know you\u2019ve hit that plaster so you have to use a really \u2013 almost a concrete nail or something to get it in there.\u00a0 But anyway, it\u2019s pretty interesting.\u00a0 Very sturdily built but one thing which is kind of a fun story.\u00a0 When the Shands sisters came to visit us was that during the depression when they had (inaudible) artists?\u00a0 Do y\u2019all remember that painting at Will Jacks house?\u00a0 That was in the, let\u2019s see you come in the front dining room and then there was the sun porch and then that other room that I call the sitting room.\u00a0 Well over the mantel, it was Gerald\u2019s office there\u2019s this gorgeous painting.\u00a0 And it looks like a painting and I asked about it and Jamie said that during the \u201830\u2019s when the Denton\u2019s were there that an (inaudible) artist came and painted this on the wall and they did molding on the wall so that it looks like a frame.\u00a0 Well according to the sisters in the library, this whole wall right behind us was painted with a mural over the fireplace on both sides.\u00a0 By the time we bought the house it had long since been either sheet rocked over or painted over.\u00a0 There was no \u2013 and it made me so sad to know.\u00a0 But of course I didn\u2019t know that at the time.\u00a0 I didn\u2019t \u2013 we had lived here ten years by the time the Shands came back and started telling us stories of different things.\u00a0 And we had \u2013 it had been a Music Room originally and we did it kind of a Music Room and a Library and added all those bookcases.\u00a0 And there was a door at the other end of that room that opened into this little hallway which we think that was a back door.\u00a0 And under the stairs were all these pipes.\u00a0 We think at some point that must have been sort of like a little mud room.\u00a0 They had a sink and I have no idea what else.\u00a0 But it was very obviously plumbing of some variety.\u00a0 Not a toilet but you know, water and that sink.<\/p>\n

CM:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Have you found lots of things in renovations?\u00a0 Have you found newspapers and have you found other things?<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Not a whole lot of interest.\u00a0 In the attic there were some interesting things but not so \u2013 and they cleaned it out pretty well.\u00a0 The thing that was pretty interesting is the fact that in the back yard there was a garage, a two car garage with \u2013 well, I say that but it might have been for just one vehicle and it probably was, but it was wider and maybe that was a workroom on the other side.\u00a0 By the time we moved in there was just remnants.\u00a0 And the back yard was just a disaster in terms of stuff.\u00a0 And when I had the little children, when we moved in Mary Elizabeth was like six, Margaret was \u2013 she was younger than that, Mary Elizabeth must have been about three for she was born in \u201979 so she was \u2013 gosh, she wasn\u2019t but a couple of years.\u00a0 Margaret was born here, she was born here, she was born in, when was Margaret born?<\/p>\n

I take that back, Mary Elizabeth was born \u2013 I\u2019m getting very confused.\u00a0 Mary Elizabeth was born in \u201976 and Margaret was born in \u201979, so Margaret was just a couple of years old and then Kirkham Wright was born, he was born in \u201983.\u00a0 Anyway it was filled with bamboo and just stuff.\u00a0 But the yard had wonderful azaleas everywhere, even in the back yard. But there was also all these pipes that were from the plumbing or whatever and gas things that went to this other house.\u00a0 And I\u2019m not sure what all else was back there but it just made you really nervous so as we cleaned up slowly and the plumbers would come and they would chop off this and we\u2019d try to get grass to grow.\u00a0 And you would find all sorts of little pieces of concrete and old bricks and a lot of glass.\u00a0 You know broken things as in you know, china and dishes.\u00a0 Not anything fine, just stuff.<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Everyday.<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah, things. And all sorts of tools.\u00a0 You would find busted old hammers and screwdrivers and that might have been in the workroom in the corner.\u00a0 Whatever stuff you leave in a garage or whatever.\u00a0 But evidently when Mrs. Shands lived here, the story goes that you know in the early teens in the railroad community there was not a lot of no restaurants and things.\u00a0 Mr. Shands being the attorney for the railroad had visitors come and Mrs. Shands\u2019 duty was to cook and she served a wonderful meal every day.\u00a0 And she cooked you know for however many regardless.\u00a0 And she never knew who was coming home but whoever lived in the little house, evidently it was her cook and her helpers, and she had, the hole is in the cook where she had her bell to the kitchen.\u00a0 You know to come and serve.\u00a0 And I think we finally filled the whole in the wall in the little butler\u2019s pantry there.\u00a0 And according to Keith Dockery she had many elegant parties during her time before Mr. Shands died.\u00a0 But my favorite story is that his biggest duty was to defend the railroad against farmers whose cows had been ran over by the train.\u00a0 Funny.<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Poor cows.<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I know, isn\u2019t that sad?\u00a0 But they didn\u2019t know any better to get off the track and I guess they weren\u2019t fixed as well.<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Not any fences.<\/p>\n

CM:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Do you have stories about parties and entertainment?\u00a0 The elegant parties that she had, or I know you had the Arts \u2013 the Crosstie here, and a wedding.<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Oh absolutely, a wedding.\u00a0 I don\u2019t know a lot about the Shands but everybody Keith\u2019s age and others have said that there was always many parties.\u00a0 Always lots of fun.\u00a0 I know they had a piano.\u00a0 I don\u2019t know what they did for music and entertainment, but evidently it was the place to come.<\/p>\n

CM:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Keith is not from Cleveland either is she?<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 No Kirk is not either.\u00a0 He grew up in Holmes County and we arrived just kind of a fluke.<\/p>\n

CM:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 (Inaudible)<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Kirkham was graduating from law school and was interviewing for a job in Greenville and Indianola.\u00a0 And my parents lived in Arcola, well actually in Hollandale.\u00a0 They live in Arcola now.\u00a0 And so we drove down from Oxford to spend the night and at some point during the week my mother, who has always bought her cars from Ed Kossman, came up to have her car serviced or whatever and he said, \u201cHow are the children and how is everybody?\u201d\u00a0 And she gave, you know how you do, \u201cWell Allegra is in Columbus and she\u2019s doing fine and Hilda and Kirkham are coming home this weekend.\u00a0 Kirk graduates in May from law school and looking for a job and he is going to be interviewing in Greenville and Indianola this weekend.\u201d\u00a0 And Ed said, \u201cYou know at Rotary the other day Arthur McIntosh said they are looking for an attorney.\u00a0 I\u2019ll tell him.\u201d\u00a0 And so sure enough the next day Kirkham gets a phone call.\u00a0 I don\u2019t remember who called whether it was C. Arthur or Mr. Jacobs or whomever and so he set up an interview in Cleveland as well.\u00a0 Anyway, we ended up here and (inaudible) that was in, I can\u2019t remember, it had to be like in April.\u00a0 We were fond of Indianola.\u00a0 Really thought that would be, we would just love it.\u00a0 We knew a lot of people there.\u00a0 We did not know a soul in Cleveland.\u00a0 And as it turned out, Kirkham graduated in August.\u00a0 They don\u2019t do that anymore.\u00a0 He lacked whatever course, some short course, so he finished in summer school.\u00a0 But a good friend of ours was graduating in May and here it was April and he did not have a job and he was also interviewing in Indianola.\u00a0 Although we did not know that. But they called Kirkham and said they were desperate for some help and that they could not wait on him until August.\u00a0 We were heartbroken.\u00a0 But we thought that was a very nice way to say, \u201cWe\u2019re hiring so and so.\u201d<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 That was (inaudible) that you found out that.<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 But we didn\u2019t know that at the time.\u00a0 And then the next \u2013 and when the person told him you know that he was going to Indianola.\u00a0 Kirkham said, \u201cOh really!\u00a0\u00a0 Who are you going to work for?\u201d\u00a0 But things have a way of working out.<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Oh absolutely.\u00a0 Kind of like Delta State.\u00a0 It just happens.\u00a0 It is for a good reason that you landed here.<\/p>\n

CM:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Do your pocket doors still work?<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 They do.\u00a0 So do these in the living room.\u00a0 And we do use them a lot.\u00a0 Well not so much these but I use these a lot when we have parties you know to close them off.\u00a0 Just a little dinner party or something, or even a bigger party when you can do, you know, serve drinks and hors d\u2019 oeuvre and then open the buffet and it is just kind of nice.\u00a0 I love them.<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 With a bit of flourish, opening the doors.<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Oh absolutely.\u00a0 And you can have your toast or prayers on the stairs. There have been many blessings said from that staircase, as well as many toasts and many announcements.\u00a0 We did a wedding announcement from the stairs.\u00a0 We\u2019ve had several wedding announcement parties and the father of whomever the bride was..<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Traditions that have started.<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Did their toasts.<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Well who knows.\u00a0 In a hundred years there might be people coming back to this house saying, \u201cDo you remember when your mother or your grandmother was announced on the steps here?\u201d<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 That is funny.\u00a0 They are all fun.<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 What attracted you to this house?\u00a0 This property?<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Didn\u2019t know a thing about it.\u00a0 How odd.\u00a0 I mean, really.\u00a0 I had never been to \u2013 you know College cuts up there \u2013 you know this is a little dead end?\u00a0 I had never seen this house.\u00a0 And we moved here in \u201973 and we moved to Cleveland in \u201973 and moved to this house in \u2018\u201981 and I had never seen it until like the week before we bought it.\u00a0 But we knew that we wanted to live in the old neighborhood.\u00a0 The big thing at the time was everybody was trying to buy a lot from Hillcrest Circle.\u00a0 When we moved here that was not full.\u00a0 There were still vacant lots over there.\u00a0 And that was just not what we wanted, although at some point Kirk finally did buy a lot over there which we saved for a little while.\u00a0 But once when we did sell it I was thrilled.\u00a0 But we would do things like, and this is so \u2013 we would read the obituaries and we would ride and we knew houses and we would know, you know, who was not in good health and we would watch \u2026.<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 See how things were going.<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Every night, we did.\u00a0 I mean that is embarrassing to say.\u00a0 I know a lot of people have done it.\u00a0 It\u2019s not \u2013 and I\u2019ve said that and\u2026<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 It\u2019s so southern.<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I\u2019ve said that and people would say, \u201cThat\u2019s not a bad idea.\u00a0 Just watch.\u201d\u00a0 But as luck would have it, the Walt Service Station was the gathering point for everybody for all the news in town.\u00a0 And Kirk\u2019s office was in the Commerce Building and so any news\u2026And whoever said, \u201cWomen do more gossiping.\u00a0 They know everything.\u201d\u00a0 So they would sit at Walt\u2019s Service Station every morning and they would drink coffee and Kirkham got word that Mrs. Ashley was living here by herself by however many years and that she had decided that she wanted to downsize.\u00a0 So from however Kirkham got up his nerve and called her up and said you know, \u201cWe would love to buy your house.\u201d\u00a0 And I had not even seen it and knew nothing about any of this.\u00a0 And so I\u2019m at home and he calls me up and says, \u201cHilda, I think I\u2019ve found us a house.\u201d\u00a0 And I said, \u201cYou\u2019re kidding.\u00a0 Where is it?\u201d\u00a0 And he told me and I said, \u201cAre you sure?\u00a0 Where is this?\u201d\u00a0 And he said, \u201cI\u2019m coming.\u00a0 I\u2019ll be there in a minute.\u201d\u00a0 And so he came and got me and we came over and came and looked at the house.\u00a0 And it was really interesting.\u00a0 I\u2019m trying to think.\u00a0 This is the only light fixture that\u2019s still here.\u00a0 I have the light fixture that was in the dining room and it was a brass fixture similar to this but square.\u00a0 And I mean, it didn\u2019t have the thing in the middle, but you know, the little crossbars, and it is actually out in the \u2013 I have it outside.\u00a0 When Mary Elizabeth bought their house and I had bought this chandelier, she took that light fixture and put it in her house down the street and it was perfect.\u00a0 But she saved it.\u00a0 When she sold her house she took it back down. And I couldn\u2019t let it go so I still have it.\u00a0 I feel like I\u2019ll find a spot for it again.\u00a0 But in that room, they had taken down the original fixture.\u00a0 Evidently right before she decided to buy it, she took out a number of really big fixtures and put them in an antique shop over in Drew and told me if I was interested I could go buy them.\u00a0 Well, it was a challenge for us to be buying this house.\u00a0 We had three children and you know, so we had to make decisions and the things that I decided on were these two mirrors, the tier mirror and then there\u2019s the Queen Anne mirror in the den in there and then somewhere in there is a little round oak mirror that I thought wonderful.\u00a0 And the option was, you know she had a lot of Victorian furniture.\u00a0 And you know, you just do what you can do.\u00a0 So we moved into the house and painted and it was very empty.\u00a0 The dining room was the Christmas tree room for a number of years.\u00a0 Then we finally got a dining room table and the library became the Christmas tree room.\u00a0 Anyway, \u2026<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Does the Christmas tree have a room now?<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 It doesn\u2019t have a room now.\u00a0 It\u2019s just in the corner.<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 It has to share.<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Anyway, that was funny.<\/p>\n

CM:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 What structural changes have you made to the house?\u00a0 You said you didn\u2019t make any to the front.\u00a0 Have you made any to the back?<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 We did.\u00a0 But mostly upstairs until recently.\u00a0 We added on that little back section which is, the main reason being is that we wanted a bathroom upstairs and the bathroom that was in our bedroom.\u00a0 Do you remember me saying that the original apartment up there had a bathroom that was separate?\u00a0 That belonged to it?\u00a0 Anyway, it was really tiny and we wanted a real bathroom.<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 So beyond that one that was in your bedroom, there was no bathroom upstairs?<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 No, there were two others.\u00a0 They were shared, yeah.\u00a0 There is one up above the piano because one year right at the Christmas holidays we were on our way to a party and I remember the people were coming to pick us up and I ran to the door, and I ran back to get my coat and \u2013 it was Tom and Alinda actually, and she said, I came back and she said, \u201cHilda your ceiling is dripping in the piano.\u201d\u00a0 And so we got a big bucket.\u00a0 You can\u2019t move it, it weighs three tons and oh, and I covered it over with a big, I\u2019ve forgotten what we found.\u00a0 Anyway it turns \u2013 I told my son, you know, (inaudible) was his room.\u00a0 I said, \u201cYou cannot turn the water on, you cannot do anything.\u201d\u00a0 But when they finally, they had to you know, cut a hole in the ceiling to get to it, it was an old iron pipe and a nail had hit it when they had hit it when they were building the house.\u00a0 At that point it would have been you know seventy or sixty-five or whatever earlier.\u00a0 The nail finally rusted.<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Rusted away.<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 And the water you know \u2013<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Oh my.<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Pretty funny.<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yes.<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 But anyway so that bathroom, there were two bathrooms and on this side there were three bedrooms upstairs and one bath.\u00a0 And it was a nightmare.\u00a0 Two girls were fighting in the bathroom and not conducive to sharing it.\u00a0 You know it was just this long little bathroom \u2013 it was very nice \u2013 and the toilet was behind the tub and the little sink was there.\u00a0 And the sink was right in front of the toilet.\u00a0 So I mean there was no convenience there.\u00a0 You couldn\u2019t get to it even.\u00a0 So every morning was just fighting. So I think in \u201990 \u2013 1990 we redid that side and took the middle bedroom and cut it in half and used \u2013 made all that area into a bathroom that went between the back bedroom and the front bedroom and then the other half, actually it was less than half, I made a little small walk through office that acted also as a hallway.\u00a0 And so that worked out really smoothly.\u00a0 I would go give you a tour except everybody is up there.\u00a0 I\u2019ll give you a downstairs tour.\u00a0 But you\u2019ve seen it.\u00a0 Cam has been here and has seen most of it I think.<\/p>\n

CM:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I didn\u2019t come in to most of it I think.\u00a0 So I saw some of it.\u00a0 Did you \u2013 when did Kirkham buy his building for his office?\u00a0 Was it much later or \u2026<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 \u201991.\u00a0 November 21st we moved in and then we opened.\u00a0 And then soon after we had a grand opening party which was great fun.\u00a0 It was the first week in December or the end of November.\u00a0 It was right after Thanksgiving.\u00a0 And I don\u2019t know that a law firm had ever done such an event in Cleveland, but I guess we like to have a party.\u00a0 So we had a grand opening and the conference room became the, you know, the buffet table.\u00a0 And we turned the back parking lot into a giant bar.<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Oh, fabulous.<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 And invited everybody in town that we could think of and told others that didn\u2019t get invitations until we ran out of invitations.\u00a0 And it was a lot of fun.\u00a0 But that was after Desert Storm, so that seemed to be \u2013 Kirkham had been in Jacobs, Eddins, Povall , Meador and Crump up to that point.\u00a0 And he left to go to Desert Storm in December of \u201990 and we were in the throws of doing this renovation.<\/p>\n

CM:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Kirkham left to go to Desert Storm?<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 He was gone a little over six months, which was better than a lot of people, I mean it might have been closer to seven.\u00a0 Left in December and I think came back in July, middle of July, so it was about seven months.\u00a0 And I will never forget we were you know, all the Iraq things going on and you were hearing about it on the news and Kirkham had been to drill and we knew it was coming up and our congressman, who at the time was Sonny Montgomery, was just adamant that the National Guard should go to war.\u00a0 So they could prove who they were.\u00a0 But the regular Army I don\u2019t think wanted them that much and the Mississippi Calvary that he was in, the 187th, went \u2013 ended up in Fort Hood.\u00a0 And actually they were the 155th, I\u2019m sorry.\u00a0 Anyway, they ended up out there but we had been \u2013 the weekend that we had gotten the announcement, we had been to a football game in New Orleans, I mean Baton Rouge LSU.\u00a0 And we came home and he answered the phone and it said, \u201cThe Warring Bull.\u201d\u00a0 And that was the code.\u00a0 And he had to show up, he had twenty-four hours to get where it was they were going, which was Camp Shelby.\u00a0 Now, I\u2019m \u2013 I laugh \u2013 I\u2019m talking way too much.<\/p>\n

CM:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 You said that building came about at the close of Desert Storm.<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Okay, I did.\u00a0 He did, when he returned home in July it was like one of those epiphany\u2019s that you know, \u201cWhy am I doing this?\u00a0 Life is too short and I want to do what I want to do.\u201d\u00a0 And the firm had looked at buying this building and I can\u2019t remember what the deal was about why the decision was made that that was not going to happen.\u00a0 But anyway, I think Lindsey and Robert decided that they were going to go somewhere else.\u00a0 So anyway, Kirkham made the arrangements to purchase the building and we had two weeks to you know, do whatever it was that we were going to do and we went through and I mean I did some serious decision making and we carpeted, painted, wallpapered, and just cleaned it up and did almost all of that in two weeks.\u00a0 It was quite remarkable because nothing had been done to that building in years and years and years.\u00a0 Sam Langston had bought it and done a little to it but I mean, it needed a lot of freshening up so we did.\u00a0 And it was great fun and Kirkham has not regretted it.<\/p>\n

CM:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Have you done any structural to it?\u00a0 Is that the closest home in Cleveland?<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 The other home that was built at the exact same time more or less which was about 1884 is the Moses Coleman home which is that Halfway Shelter, the Rainbow Shelter House.\u00a0 It was built about the same time.\u00a0 But it was on the other side of the bayou.\u00a0 So this is the oldest on the west side.\u00a0 If you think about where they are.\u00a0 They were just right down on Jones Bayou.\u00a0 And if you think of Jones Bayou was much bigger.\u00a0 And the transportation.\u00a0 You know people went up and down the bayou.\u00a0 And all of this was just a big swamp.\u00a0 Trees.<\/p>\n

CM:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 And when did you move the house that was the Baptist parsonage?<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Probably \u2013 was it 2001 maybe.<\/p>\n

CM:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Every ten years or so you (inaudible) a project?<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I don\u2019t know.\u00a0 If that\u2019s the case I must be getting close.\u00a0\u00a0 Kirkham and I were talking the other night.\u00a0 With the Historic District coming up you know to light, I mean we\u2019ve been working on it since 2003 at least, maybe 2002.\u00a0 The Heritage Commission trying to get it happening.\u00a0 And Mary Elizabeth is working on her tax credits on her house.\u00a0 And Signe Adams is too and she\u2019s excited.\u00a0 So anyway we were talking about that and Kirkham said – that house that is just right down from you and I just love, and I think it might have been that Baptist parsonage.\u00a0 It\u2019s got that window up above.\u00a0 And we were talking and Kirkham said, \u201cHilda, why don\u2019t you and Mary Elizabeth buy that?\u201d<\/p>\n

CM:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Would you please fix it?\u201d\u00a0 And the one next to it as well, David Bailey owns that.<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I knew that and that\u2019s a challenge.<\/p>\n

CM:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 It is.\u00a0 So what made you decide to buy the Baptist parsonage?<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Well, actually it was a gift.\u00a0 They were trying to give it away.\u00a0 And about five \u2013 many people before I got to it tried to figure out how to do it, and after consideration figured out that it was just impossible.\u00a0 Could not be done.\u00a0 That it was way too costly.\u00a0 Way too time consuming.\u00a0 And I don\u2019t know what all other \u201cway-too\u2019s.\u201d\u00a0 But it way too.\u00a0 And so I don\u2019t remember how I found how I found out about it.\u00a0 But the bank was trying to get rid of it.\u00a0 To give it away to keep from pay to tear it down.\u00a0 Which people don\u2019t realize but demolition is expensive.\u00a0 But they thought if they could give it away that would save them some money.\u00a0 So that\u2019s exactly what we ended up doing.\u00a0 And I found a mover and we were able to do the tax credits and I think I can remember it might have been in 2000 because I had it five years when I sold it.\u00a0 And I sold it in 2005.\u00a0 Or maybe early 2006.<\/p>\n

CM:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Was the house in good shape?<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Incredible shape.\u00a0 But we found some really interesting things in it. It was done in 1886 I believe it was.\u00a0 And it was also, well it was on a row of many houses very similar.\u00a0 And it was stuffed with insulation, you know just like (inaudible).\u00a0 So when they cut it in half to move it just all this stuff went everywhere.\u00a0 It was really \u2013 but there were all sorts of things left in there.\u00a0 After it was the Baptist parsonage, I\u2019m not sure what all else it had become \u2013 a family lived there, the Stalling\u2019s.\u00a0 Their family lived there and there was one pantry that was full of family preserves.\u00a0 I mean like pickles and jelly and whatever that were probably there since 1940.<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I\u2019m sure it was distilled.<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I mean there were some really interesting things that had just never been cleaned out and these little pantry\u2019s were just closed off and at one point it was a dress shop and they had \u2013 you saw on the front where they had just closed the porch off and that was \u2013 I don\u2019t know, they had windows and I guess that is where they did their display or whatever \u2013 their showroom.\u00a0 But anyway, we got it moved.\u00a0 I actually have a video of the moving that was saved because they either had to stop traffic to get it\u2026<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 (inaudible)<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Uh hmm.<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 (inaudible)<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Over on this side is where they had \u2013 that was their little display room.\u00a0 It doesn\u2019t really look like \u2013 I don\u2019t know what they did.\u00a0 It was pretty disastrous.\u00a0 Anyway we got it done and by using the federal tax credit, you know it made it almost profitable.\u00a0 It was not a loss but you know as Kirk would say, by the time you got through you didn\u2019t really make much of a profit.<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 But you saved Cleveland.<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 But it saved the house.\u00a0 My father just had a fit.\u00a0 He said, \u201cWhy are you doing this?\u00a0 You could build a house cheaper?\u201d<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I said, \u201cYou\u2019ve missed the whole point.\u201d<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 What gets you involved in historic preservation?\u00a0 Was it your training in school or is it just a passion?<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 You know (inaudible) and I have a Master\u2019s degree in (inaudible).\u00a0 The \u2013 you know I\u2019ve always loved history and Kirk has always loved history.\u00a0 When \u2013 back in the late \u201880\u2019s or early \u201890\u2019s, you know how you get that letter from the Chamber and it says what committee would you serve on.\u00a0 (inaudible)<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 It\u2019s okay.<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 But I do.\u00a0 I\u2019ve been on committees and we attend stuff and do all those things, but I had never served on something that I really enjoyed at the Chamber.\u00a0 And that year when the letter came out it had a little thing to check that said \u201cHistoric Preservation Sub-Committee\u201d.\u00a0 And I don\u2019t even know what it was a sub-committee of but it was something to do with Cleveland, so I put a check mark beside that.\u00a0 (inaudible) need to do some stuff around here but it\u2019s kind of sad.\u00a0 All along the railroad track where the walking trail is? \u00a0It used to be a whole row of shotgun houses there when we moved here.\u00a0 And I remember when the last one left, it made me so sad.\u00a0 The guy didn\u2019t want to move.\u00a0 He didn\u2019t want to leave his house. And I\u2019ll bet you\u2019ve heard that story.\u00a0 But he was there until they showed up with a bulldozer.\u00a0 But anyway all of it was just falling down around us and which now commonly you hear the expression \u201ctear down.\u201d\u00a0 Oxford is just suffering from tear-downs.\u00a0 But anyway, evidently I was sensing all of that and so he was like \u201cgo to the meeting\u201d and so the next thing that happened I was chairman and what do we do?\u00a0 So I just got busy and I don\u2019t remember who I called or how but I got to investigating and calling Archives and History, and you know now I\u2019m best friends with everybody down there.\u00a0 Not really, but I love them all.\u00a0 And they\u2019ve done many good things you know to help Cleveland.\u00a0 And discovered the way to get help is by being a Certified Local Government so I went to the Mayor and Mayor King was just wonderful.\u00a0 He said, \u201cHilda, you figure it out and whatever you think we need to do we will do it.\u201d\u00a0 And you can\u2019t ask for any better support.\u00a0 And he was just fabulous.<\/p>\n

CM:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 What happened to the row of houses you said that were where the Baptist parsonage was?\u00a0 You said had been a row of houses.\u00a0 What happened to them?<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 They were little cottages and they all disappeared.\u00a0 In fact that photograph, this photograph I got from Sue King and she lived \u2013 that is Sue, well at an early age of about three \u2013 two or three- and this \u2013 you can\u2019t see it in this because I have narrowed it down to show the house, but right here is a little bicycle thing\u00a0 – you can tell that is what that is, a bicycle.\u00a0 And she is standing right here.\u00a0 I\u2019ve got to \u2013 I don\u2019t know what I\u2019ve done with that photograph, but I have it somewhere.<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 We would love to get a copy.<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 And \u2026.<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Did she give you the original?<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Oh no.\u00a0 She\u2019s got it.\u00a0 And they called them the \u201choneymoon cottages.\u201d<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Honeymoon cottages.\u00a0 But were they there when y\u2019all got to town or were they already gone by then?<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 This was the only one that I remember.\u00a0 But it doesn\u2019t look anything like a honeymoon cottage does it?<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Well it really\u2026<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 But they were really cute.\u00a0 But you can tell they were not enclosed underneath and they were \u2013 but anyway, so I just say thanks to Mayor King. And Ned Mitchell I think had the idea at the Chamber to do that.\u00a0 And then he said, \u201cHilda, you do it.\u201d\u00a0 And that\u2019s not exactly true because he was on the committee.<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 It is so much easier to move forward with (inaudible)<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 No doubt.<\/p>\n

CM:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 It just seems like there is so much to talk about.<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Well I have a question about this house.\u00a0 This house seems to have so many stories it could tell.\u00a0 What do you hope \u2013 what impression have you left on this house having owned it?\u00a0 The next people that own this house, how do you want them to see it?<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Oh just as a\u2026it\u2019s been such a great place for our family.\u00a0 I mean I just think lost – the house is so full of memories \u2013 you just can\u2019t even you know, whenever you leave, I mean even your little place when you go on vacation you have all these wonderful memories.\u00a0 I mean we just have loved being here and it\u2019s been fun to share it with you know your friends.\u00a0 I mean whenever there is a need for something to go on, Kirkham is real quick to say, \u201cWe can do that.\u00a0 Let\u2019s do that.\u201d\u00a0 And it\u2019s fun.\u00a0 Example, coming up this Christmas there is going to be a wedding at the Church in December. And ironically I received a phone call from a friend who is on the Heritage Trust Board.\u00a0 And she called me and said, \u201cHilda I have a friend in Jackson whose son is getting married in Cleveland in December and she is divorced, and so the father is having her son a Rehearsal Dinner at KC\u2019s and she would like to have her sort of Pre-Rehearsal Party and can you help her?\u00a0 I told her I had a good friend in Cleveland that would know exactly where to have this party.\u00a0 Can you help us out?\u00a0 And I said, \u201cOh goodness, you know, the Gallery, but that\u2019s ten miles away.\u00a0 You know, the Church is not very conducive \u2013 the Parish Hall \u2013 but it\u2019s going to be by next spring we are going to have it fixed up, but it is not going to help you now.<\/p>\n

Side B<\/em><\/p>\n

I said, \u201cWho is the groom?\u00a0 I mean, who is this person?\u201d\u00a0 I kind of had an idea.\u00a0 She told me who it was.\u00a0 And I said, \u201cYou are not going to believe this, but our families \u2013 her family \u2013 my family were good friends.\u00a0 Our parents were really good friends.\u00a0 I know you know Kit and her younger sister, and she had a younger sister that was my age.\u00a0 And the middle sister was my older sister\u2019s age.\u00a0\u00a0 And so I always knew Kit.\u00a0 But our parents were just best friends.\u00a0 My daddy and her father.\u00a0 I mean I knew him almost you know like a really special friend because my daddy talked about him all the time.\u00a0 They were always on the phone and I said, \u201cOh that is great.\u00a0 I am so excited.\u201d\u00a0 I said, \u201cWell let me think on this project and I will get back with you tomorrow.\u201d\u00a0 So of course I came home and told Kirkham and he was really good friends with the middle sister.\u00a0 And we talked about where the possibilities were, and then you narrow it down.\u00a0 And we came up with two options and I called her back the next day and I said, \u201cFriend.\u201d\u00a0 Because I didn\u2019t have Kit\u2019s number and I had told her I would call her back.\u00a0 I said, \u201cI can come up with two options.\u00a0 One is you can have a small gathering at one end of the upstairs of the Warehouse, but it is not really terribly conducive to a small event.\u00a0 And the other option is you can have it at my house.\u00a0 And we will make all the arrangements and we will leave if you want us to, you can use the house for just an hour and a half and we can slip out and go somewhere.\u00a0 Whatever y\u2019all choose you know.\u201d\u00a0 So anyway, sure enough they came up the next day and they came by the office and we visited and so I gave them a tour and showed them the Church, and places downtown.\u00a0 Anyway, she called me and came by the house and I told them things that they can do and we talked about it and gave her the name of the caterer and the bartender and I said, \u201cAnd they don\u2019t need me because they\u2019ve done stuff and they know where all my plates and china and silver is and they can find it and you\u2019ll be fine.\u201d\u00a0 And so she called me back the next day and she said, \u201cOh Hilda, I accept.\u201d\u00a0 And so I called her father and he was just thrilled and she said that her mother almost cried you know it was just so special.\u00a0 Well it was just such a fluke.\u00a0 It was just meant to me because you know small world.\u00a0 But anyway, so we are going to have another party.<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yea!<\/p>\n

CM:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Did you grow up in an older home?<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Not terribly older home.\u00a0 It was a house, I mean at the time when we were growing up it didn\u2019t seem that old.\u00a0 It was built in the late \u201840\u2019s and it was a neat old house.\u00a0 It was neat.\u00a0 But it was built like an older home.\u00a0 And in fact, it had tall ceilings.\u00a0 Yeah, it was a reproduction.\u00a0 How about that.\u00a0 It was a neat reproduction.\u00a0 But it had you know nice ceiling molding and it had big doors similar to this in the dining room.\u00a0 But it didn\u2019t have the pocket doors. They just opened.\u00a0 And I like those pocket doors.\u00a0 I like being able to close them which is funny.\u00a0 But anyway I know the family that lives there now and I\u2019m crazy about them.\u00a0 And when they moved in I was thrilled that somebody \u2013 and that\u2019s the way I feel about this house.\u00a0 When we\u2019re gone I hope somebody will get it that really loves it and will want to not, I don\u2019t know, retrofit it or something to make it something that it\u2019s not.\u00a0 So anyway\u2026<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 If you knew when you first bought this house what you know now, would you still buy this house?<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Absolutely.\u00a0 I mean, I would do a much better job.\u00a0 I would a better job. It\u2019s funny.\u00a0 I have learned so much, I mean not intentionally, but just by you know, working.\u00a0 Of course, you know you do learn from your mistakes but just different things that I have learned about old materials that I didn\u2019t know before that I could have saved some things and maybe I didn\u2019t save.\u00a0 And I kind of you know wished that I had done it.\u00a0 I\u2019m not sure that I would ever go back and buy any of those old light fixtures.\u00a0\u00a0 They were just, I don\u2019t know, gaudy. They were real big and you know, took up \u2013 the one in that room I cannot tell you just stood out and it was copper and it had all these leg things that stuck out you know and hanging in all different directions.\u00a0 And evidently it was a gas fixture that had you know been retrofitted for electricity.\u00a0 But I mean it was really neat and interesting, but wow, I mean it just\u2026.<\/p>\n

CM:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Had she taken any of these mirrors out and taken them to the antique place?<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 They were still here and she really wanted to sell them because I mean they weighed \u2026<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 How could she get them out?<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Yeah.\u00a0 They weighed two tons, I mean they are so heavy.\u00a0 It took five or six guys, six men to you know lift them.<\/p>\n

CM:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Did she just have them sitting there and they worked?<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 This one was actually here.\u00a0 The one that is in the library was in the dining room and I just didn\u2019t like it in the dining room.\u00a0 I like it better in there.<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 (inaudible)<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 It was a challenge.\u00a0 And when they took them down to paint, which we have done twice\u2026<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 The walls or to paint them?<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 The walls.<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Oh okay.<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 This one I called Bill Lester to come.\u00a0 It\u2019s got some few chips on it and he said he could fix it.\u00a0 We have not done that yet but I know he can do it.\u00a0 I guess I\u2019d better come and do the little repairs before he leaves and goes somewhere else now that he\u2019s retired.\u00a0 But I don\u2019t think he\u2019s leaving.\u00a0 I don\u2019t think he\u2019s leaving but I was thrilled he did come and you know figure out he could do it.<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 (inaudible) transplants get stuck in the mud and (inaudible).<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Oh goodness.\u00a0 But see that\u2019s another connection.\u00a0 I mean, Bill\u2019s mother and my father were really good friends growing up.\u00a0 And my father dated his mother in college.<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 How neat.<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Isn\u2019t that funny?\u00a0 And when my parents moved, my dad had a painting that his mother, Margurite, had given him of a scene in Hollandale.\u00a0 It was the Blue Front Caf\u00e9, anyway, so he gave it to me and I gave it to Bill.\u00a0 So I just thought he should have it.\u00a0 And then he gave it to his daughter, McCloud.\u00a0 So I hope she loves it, I don\u2019t know that she does.<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 You need to tell her the story.<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I don\u2019t know if Bill told her the story or not, I\u2019ll have to ask him.\u00a0 Anyway, I thought it was great and very dear and a real treasure.\u00a0 That was hard, but I thought she should have it.\u00a0 I mean that Bill should have it.\u00a0 That he, you know, so\u2026 things like that you just\u00a0 don\u2019t \u2013 you know the family ought to have them.\u00a0 So anyway..<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Cam, do you have any more questions?
\nCM:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I think we have covered it pretty well.<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I\u2019ve talked way too much.<\/p>\n

CM:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 No, we talk for hours.<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Oh yes.<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 I would love to give you a little short tour.<\/p>\n

EW:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Okay.<\/p>\n

CM:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Do you mind if I took some pictures of like the woodwork.<\/p>\n

HP:\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0\u00a0 Oh no, not at all.<\/p>\n

Tape Ends<\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

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